“The Pseudo-Psychologist”
The “Pseudo-Psychologist” does not necessarily have to be a school psychologist. It is any staff member who begins throwing around psychological terms as if they are certain they have all of the answers. Far worse is when you get the Pseudo-Psychologist who starts opining as to the appropriateness of the medications your child is taking! Medical decisions should be made by medical doctors, not IEP Team members (in fact, this is prohibited by law in Connecticut)!
Let me start by providing a bit of information that virtually all parents I talk to don’t realize: a “school psychologist” is not the same thing as a “clinical psychologist.”
What does that mean? Well, in many states it means that the school psychologist is licensed NOT by any mental health agency, but rather by the Department of Education. This further means that most school psychologists could not “hang out a shingle” and start a private practice as a “psychologist,” because they are only really licensed to provide services within a school environment.
You need to fully understand the qualifications and licensure of the individuals in your school district who are making recommendations about your child.
I can not tell you how many parents of children with disabilities I talk to who, as I am gathering background information, will say something like “that’s what the psychologist told me,” or even, “that’s what the school’s psychiatrist recommended.” Yet when I probe, I learn that the parent is referring to the school psychologist. Why does it matter? Because often the parent relies on the advice of this individual, sometimes even if it contradicts the recommendations and diagnoses of outside mental health professionals whose credentials and training far exceed the traditional path of the school psychologist. Most parents have no clue that they are taking the advice of an educational professional who in many cases is not even licensed to issue the diagnoses that their outside professional has given!
If you have obtained a diagnosis and recommendations from an outside psychologist or psychiatrist, do not assume that your district’s “school psychologist” has comparable training and background to refute these.
Don’t get me wrong, there is a place for school psychologists, and it’s an important role. I have worked with many over the years who are incredibly skilled and helpful. Moreover, school psychologists often know a great deal about educational testing and how a particular learning style might play out in a school environment. That is their training. But when a parent comes into an IEP meeting with a diagnosis of, for example, Tourette Syndrome from a psychiatrist, and the school psychologist discounts the diagnosis, I think parents have a right to understand that one professional is a medical doctor and licensed mental health professional, and the other is in many cases a Bachelors level educational professional.
School psychologists are by no means the only school staff members who can play the role of the “Pseudo-Psychologist.”
At least school psychologists have focused their education and training on the psychological aspect of education, and often special education. What I find far more frustrating is when you get a guidance counselor or principal who makes statements like “you know, I interned at a psychiatric hospital when I was in college, and this sounds a lot like it might be Bipolar Disorder.” Heavens. A college internship does not a doctor make.
This is the worst kind of Pseudo-Psychologist, because this person really thinks they know what they are talking about, and their confidence leads the parents of the child with special education needs to rely upon their conclusions. Sometimes years pass without the proper intervention being put into place because a family has agreed with assessments made by the school district which they really were not in a position to make.
Most parents believe what the school district staff tell them without questioning the source.
The vast majority of parents of children with special education needs do not even begin to second-guess the recommendations of the school district staff. They assume that they are the experts, and they follow their advice. It is often only when a situation has become intolerable that parents begin to challenge the appropriateness of their school’s decisions. Unfortunately, sometimes it is then too late.
My best advice for countering the Pseudo-Psychologist is to ask specific questions about their background. Then, if you are not satisfied that this person has the necessary credentials to properly assess your child’s special education needs, it might be time to ask for an Independent Educational Evaluation.
Love this perspective and it’s a common theme I work on with parents often in my practice too!
http://www.precisioneducation.com
When the IEE is done by a “close personal firend” of the district’s special ed director (a relationship neither chose to disclose), it can hardly be considered an INDEPENDENT educational evaluation…
Rochelle, you are right, which is why it’s always important to remember that “independent” just means someone not employed by the district, that does not guarantee you that the person is “unbiased.” Parents should always check into any evaluator thoroughly before agreeing!
I just found this website and, although this was written over a month ago, I had to comment. My daughter’s principal is the definition of this character. After receiving letters from both my daughter’s psychologist and psychiatrist indicating that the lack of support by the school was causing my daughter’s (diagnosed as gifted/low processing and fluency/ADD/Generalized Anxiety) anxiety to escalate to the point that she would need to be hospitalized if the situation didn’t improve, the principal felt compelled to email to me her “diagnosis”. She stated that this was not a school issue, it was a parenting issue. Her recommendation: Take away her books at night and lock the door so that she would be forced to sleep and forget about school. Wow! If only the doctors and I had thought of that all of her problems would have disappeared! Her psychiatrist was so frustrated and insulted that he pulled my daughter out of school and placed her on home bound instruction.
I am dumbfounded at how inaccurate the information is in the above article. First let me address the school psychologist vs clinical psychologist. True, school psychologists are credentialed by the dept of education. However, this does not mean that school psychologists are not trained adequately. On the contrary to what the article states above, school psychologists are not credentialed at the bachelor’s level. In Conn, a school psychologist is required to have at least a master’s degree, 45 semester hours of graduate work in a planned program for school psychologists, a supervised practicum, and a 10 month internship under the supervision of a certified school psychologist. Approximately 25% of school psychologists also hold doctoral degrees. Also, in most states, a clinical psychologist cannot practice in the schools unless credentialed by the dept of Ed. School psychologists are indeed the psychologist in the school setting and are the experts in how the students social and emotional functioning impact academic performance. Another fallacy in the above article is that if the school decides to consult with an outside professional, it is the school IEP team that decides to accept or not accept that particular opinion. Now, granted there are individuals who offer opinions without training or knowledge of the student. However, the good IEP team always includes the parents in ALL aspects of the plan and consults outside professionals when necessary. I think it is important for people to check their facts before they post an article about members of IEP teams and their training and qualifications.
I welcome all comments to my blog, even negative ones. However, I feel I should respond to the one by Dr. S. I am brought in when there is a dispute between parents and school districts; it is from that unabashed perspective that I write. However, I would like to note that even the National Association of School Psychologists acknowledges that the primary difference between school psychologists and clinical child psychologists is that school psychologists are not generally doctoral level professionals. http://www.nasponline.org/about_sp/careerfaq.aspx#cpsych_spsych My point was that the important role that school psychologists bring to bear is NOT THE SAME as the role of a doctoral level clinical psychologist or psychiatrist who has issued a diagnosis of a child, and that parents should not simply assume that the background and training of the school psychologist is the same when such a person attempts to challenge that diagnosis at an IEP meeting. In my experience, almost no parents are aware that there is any difference in background, they just assume that one has chosen to work for the school and the other is in private practice. I am aware of the more stringent requirements in CT, but my blog is designed for a national audience, and my posts are written that way unless they are categorized under CT specific, which this one is not.
Finally, the fact that a clinical psychologist can’t practice in the schools unless licensed by the Department of Ed means little to me; that is the case in almost any profession. I’m an attorney, but I would not be permitted to teach a high school course on civics because I am not certified by the Dept of Ed., and for that matter, a neurosurgeon at Yale could not teach high school biology either!
All of that being said, I do agree that the use of the word “most” instead of “many” in reference to a bachelor’s level professional could be misleading, and I will correct that in the post. Thank you for reading.
Thank you for posting this. It is important information that parents need to know. Prior to one of our first SST meetings, I provided a copy of a formal psychological evaluation from a Licensed Clinical Psychologist who clearly spelled out my child’s diagnosis. The evaluation of my child occurred over a period of months and after numerous sessions at my own expense. The School Psychologist, who observed my child for part of a day or so, reviewed the evaluation and then stated that, in coming from a different perspective, she didn’t agree with the diagnosis.
I didn’t think to question her background, training, licensing, perspective or the comparative quality of evaluation. I simply accepted her comment as one that was coming from an expert. As a result, I didn’t push quickly enough for services or accommodations that ultimately were implemented and benefited my child years later — only after problems increased for her. I am not bashing School Psychologists, but I am supporting you in letting parents know the difference between the professions. It really helps to level the playing field when parents are properly informed of their rights and great information like this. Thank you again for the information that you are providing. Craig
Just to add. . .there is a current controversy about the use of the term “psychologist” and whether or not it should be used in reference to anyone who does not have a doctoral degree in psychology. This is very relevant, as 75% of school psychologists do not have doctoral degrees.
The American Psychological Association (APA) defines “psychologist” in its General Guidelines, which states that “Psychologists have a doctoral degree in psychology from an organized, sequential program in a regionally accredited university or professional school.” APA also states that it is “not responsible for the specific title or wording of any particular position opening, but it is general pattern to refer to master’s-level positions as counselors, specialists, clinicians, and so forth (rather than as ‘psychologists’).”
This year, APA also drafted revisions to its Model Act for State Licensure of Psychologists (Model Act) to no longer provide an exemption for master’s level school psychologists. APA’s Model Act is a policy document that provides recommendations and guidance for the licensing and practice of Psychology, and it is often used by state legislatures and licensing boards as they review standards and revise licensing laws. This is a really big deal, and no surprise, the draft Model Act has been drawing a lot of fire from the National Association of School Psychologists.
In my experience, there is a wide range of skill level among school psychologists. And certainly, having a doctoral degree doesn’t make you smarter. However, this does reflect a baseline level of training. A five-year doctoral program that includes extensive practicum experience is just not the same as a two-year master’s program.
Great discussion!
D.
I still have to debate the Bachelors level comment. I am not aware of any state that allows school psychologists to become credentialed at the bachelor’s level. According to the National Association of School Psychologists, one needs minimally a Masters Degree (NASP Web Site) to be a school psychologist. In fact, 32.6% of school psychologists reported holding a masters degree, 34.9% a specialist degree (this is a 3 year program after the Bachelor level, so higher than a Masters) and 32.4% hold a doctorate according to a recent NASP study. Now, I do agree with Jennifer that parents need to be knowledgeable consumers. I encourage parents to ask about qualifications when they meet with their teams, parents need to be an active member of the team.
Thanks so much for the discussion. I work in a school as a school counselor. In Washington State both a school counselor and a school psychologist must have a Master’s Degree and an internship in a school in their area, either counseling or psychology, unless they are dually certified. In that case the individual has to complete two internships and complete appropriate course work.
Sometimes parents apologize to me when they say I am going to take my child to a “real counselor”. What they mean is a “mental health counselor”. I understand what they mean and am glad they know that my experience, training and helpfulness differs from a mental health counselor. There are title issues with counselors as well as psychologists.
The issue of title is significant. I actually support the new Model Licensure Act proposed by the APA. As mentioned above, a doctoral program with an internship is very, very different from a two year masters program. The new Model Licensure Act will make a distinction that should be made. It will help parents to understand the roles of the professionals they work with.
The title “psychologist” carries an implication of authority in general parlance. If the standard of training and the title universally apply to all psychologists it will be very helpful.
In reply to Dr. S, I understand the various levels of training you describe within school systems. However, the title is the issue. Someone with a Doctorate in Psychology cannot use the title psychologist unless they meet the state requirements, either through the Dept. of Education or the State Licensing Board of Psychology. However, an individual with a Masters Degree and much less training can use the same title as the individual with a doctorate. The public does not know or need to know these variables.
The public deserves a clear standard. Imagine the confusion if some attorneys had Masters degrees and had not passed the a State Bar Exam, but were still allowed to refer to themselves as an attorney! Or what if, the State had MD’s who had such differing qualifications? Would the public be protected?
I see two issues: public protection and the public’s right to understand the qualifications of a professional using a title.
Very interesting thread. I’ve got to admit that I am a parent who totally understands the difference between a school psycholgist and a “real” (ie clinical) psychologist. The school psychologist in our district is so full of himself it’s sickening. This guy truly believes he knows something… Or everything. Yet his qualifications do not support him being able (qualified) to refute diagnoses, recommendations, or anything else provided by my daughters’ outside clinical (i.e doctoral level) psychologist and/or her outside psychiatrist (M.D.). But that doesn’t stop him from trying.When you have a school psychologist who is pretending he/she is a real psychologist, the child can suffer badly.
The problem is many “real” psychologists only need a few hundred dollars to give a parent what they want…a diagnosis. These parents are looking for a reason for the difficulties their children are having in school and the “real” psychologists are more than willing to take their money to give it to them.
It is true that there are differences between clinical and school psychologists, as there are between counseling psychologists, forensic psychologists, health psychologists etc. It is also true that the bell curve applies in each case. There are exceptional practitioners in each field, and then there are the outliers. Just because a person has made it through a particular program does not necessarily mean they are “better” or “real” and another practitioner is not. As a psychologist who has worked in both the clinical and school settings, my experience and training in one setting does not necessarily prepare me to work in the other. The findings from one discipline do not necessarily “trump” findings from another discipline, but should be in agreement. Parents and school districts should know the differences in both training and experience between these two fields and draw upon the resources of each for the benefit of children knowing that School Psychologists have training beyond their Master’s degree, and often the Doctorate level (not bachelor’s level as the blogger’s post states), as well as specific and ongoing training in both mental health and education.
Jay, thank you for reading and posting, and I believe you make very solid points. I do think, however, that it’s misleading to parents to have school psychologists even referred to as psychologists when they are not doctors, and SOME only have a Bachelor’s degree. I can’t tell you how many parents have referred to the school psychologist as “the school’s psychiatrist” to me, and only after a number of questions am I able to uncover that they’re referring to the school psychologist. I think we’d do both parents and educators a favor if we renamed the role to avoid this kind of confusion, and the hierarchy to which you refer. If you have ideas of a name other than “school psychologist” I’d love to hear it!
I have to say the info posted here is utterly inaccurate. It astounds me that a lawyer would add to these inaccuracies by stating that school psychologists are credentialed at the bachelor’s level. Stop it, this is flat wrong. At best this info is misleading at worst unethical. Stop it. See the NASP website for more info. It seems that this site is a thinly veiled attempt to create anxiety in parents in attempt to drum up business.
Second, as for the unseemly IEP member. It is not up to lawyers to choose an IEP team. The IEP team is chosen. It is up to the IEP team to accept outside reports or not. It is also not up to lawyers to dictate the credentialing in psychology. It is up to the American Psychological Association and the National Association of School Psychology. Both whom support the use of the school psychologist title of those with a masters, and the requisite training or higher.
As someone trained in clinical and school psychology I can comment that these are two very different specializations that are the same as other specialties in other areas for example neurology, psychiatry, etc. The matter is really one of competence. True, those with the doctorate are better educated, but not necessarily more capable. I work with a great deal of “outside” people who have very little working knowledge of the school. For that matter, clinical psychologists, counseling psychologists, etc. receive very little course work or training specific to the school, whereas school psychologist receive substantial coursework and practical experience in the school related to learning, behavior, and education. So let me pose the question, who is the best person to provide a learning evaluation on a child with suspected dyslexia… A clinical psychologist with training in clinical diagnosis and treatment of mental disorders and experience in a hospital setting, or a school psychologist who has extensive training in education and remediation of learning disabilities?
Dr. S, I see you are commenting again on this post. I hope you’ve read the comments which other readers have made since your original comment on this particular blog post.
I must take issue with several points you make, and agree with others. First, your statement that my entire site is a “thinly veiled attempt to create anxiety in parents in an attempt to drum up business” reflects ignorance both about me and this area of the law. Parents of kids with disabilities are already anxious about special education issues and with good reason, and if you read any of the dozens of other articles I’ve posted on this site besides this one which has you so riled up, perhaps you’d learn that. My goal is not to create anxiety, but to give parents INFORMATION about their legal rights so that they are empowered to advocate for their children. The vast majority of my readers are outside of Connecticut where I am licensed to practice and that’s part of why I write this blog, because here parents have access to several quality special education advocates and attorneys, but in other parts of the country they do not, and even here, many can not afford counsel. It’s my hope that even those parents can learn enough here to try to advocate for their children.
As for your interpretation as to who constitutes the IEP team, and what their legal obligations are in your statement thats it is “not up to lawyers to choose an IEP team” and that it is “up to the IEP team to accept outside reports or not,” let’s just say that I’ll promise not to practice school psychology if you promise not to practice law. The IDEA dictates who has to be part of an IEP team in order for it to be duly constituted by law, and the IDEA further requires that the IEP team consider any information presented by the parents to the team; they do not have to incorporate those recommendations into the IEP of course, but they must consider them, by law.
If you were a witness, I’d ask you to answer this question, yes or no: can a person who holds only a Bachelor’s Degree serve as a school psychologist in any public schools in this country? I’m not asking whether it happens often, or only in a few states, or what the APA and the NASP “support,” but rather whether or not it’s true that some hold only that level of degree. It’s my understanding having researched it that the answer is “yes” and I think parents should know that.
Finally, as to what we agree on, I agree that school psychologists have a different and important level of training as to what occurs in schools than clinical psychologist and psychiatrists, and that’s why I mentioned in my original post that there is an important role for these professionals in our education system. I have also known many, many clinical psychologists, neuro-psychologists, and psychiatrists who couldn’t meaningfully contribute to an IEP if their life depended on it. I also agree that what level of education an individual achieves by no means guarantees either the skills or competence of that individual. I know a lot of lawyers about whom I could say that. But I also know that a paralegal, who is an essential professional in many law firms, is not licensed to practice law, and a client has a right to know the difference between a paralegal and an attorney. They serve different functions and in my view, the consumers have a right to know the difference.
I hope you continue to read, but I also hope you can make comments in the future without making personal attacks about my professionalism simply because we don’t happen to agree on this issue.
Oh, and Dr. S., as to your question about who is the better person to provide a “learning evaluation” on a student suspected to have dyslexia, a clinical psychologist or a school psychologist, I’d say, it depends both on who the clinical psychologist is and who the school psychologist is. If the clinical psychologist is, as your hypothetical suggests, someone with experience only in a hospital setting (which doesn’t reflect the background of most of the clinical psychologists I know, but okay) versus a school psychologist who has actual training in diagnosis of dyslexia, then of course, I’d want the school psychologist. The fundamental problem I have, though, and part of what led to my including this particular unseemly IEP member in the group, is the many, many situations I’ve seen where the school psychologist simply fails to report or overlooks the signs of a disability like dyslexia, and then when the parent obtains an evaluation from a clinical psychologist who goes through the DSM and issues a diagnosis of a reading disorder, the parent needs to understand that when the school psychologist, who is a paid employee of the school district, disagrees with that diagnosis, they are not usually dealing with professionals who have the same level of training.
There are no states that credential school psychologists at the bachelor’s level. I checked each and every state. All require graduate work (i.e. Masters or Doctorate) with extensive supervised training. If you are still skeptical, consult the NASP website which lists the criteria for every state. There are some states with other titles with lesser credentials but they are not allowed to use the title “school psychologist” without the aforementioned graduate work and requisite training.
I just went to the NASP website and went through each and every state myself (although for some reason Arizona doesn’t connect on the link)…and I’m sorry, but there are at least a few states that appear to allow an individual without an advanced degree to perform the role of school psychologist. Texas, Nebraska, and Pennsylvania have at minimum confusing descriptors that I believe would allow a person who has a BA to hold themselves out as a school psychologist.
Frankly, looking at the individual States’ criteria made me even more convinced about my original point. There are numerous “levels” of school psychologist in some States, and similar sounding titles which are sure to confuse parents who don’t understand the difference. Do you actually think a parent will understand the difference between a “school psychologist level 1″ or a “school psychologist level 3″?
If you review the NASP site, and go through each state’s criteria, there is one thing that is VERY clear to me…the requirements of the various State Departments of Education (which one needs to meet in order to be called a “school psychologist”) are far less rigorous than the same State’s Board of Psychology requirements. Even if I were to accept your premise that you can’t be called a school psychologist without more than a Bachelor’s Degree (an arguable point), it doesn’t change the fact that meeting the NASP minimum standards would not qualify one for the majority of State Boards of Psychology.
My son has dyslexia and other learning disabilities that were tested for in 2nd grade. An IEP was put in place at the beginning of 3rd grade. My son has had bad problems socializing over the years. He has although done well in school academically. Last year because of the divorce my ex wanted to do something about the school thing, why he misbehaves sometimes. The IEP did the test and found out that at school and at Dad’s is the only place where these things occur. They said he was emotionally disturbed. Dad blames it on the divorce. I have taken him to Vanderbilt and had him tested, he has PPD. He was born with it, and will have it the rest of his life. How do I get the IEP team to undo the Emotionally Disturbed and put that it was just because of his PPD that he behaved that way? Dad is trying to get custody and is saying that my son does bad in school because of me. He even told the doctor at Vanderbilt that he worries about my son emotionally because of the divorce making him unhappy and withdrawn while he was there with him. My son does not even show this at school anymore. Only with dad. How do I approach this. His counselor that was assigned to him through DCS (due to dad) said that it’s not the divorce causing anything, both kids are fine with the divorce. She doesn’t even counsel him anymore. Dad has a family friend that works at my son’s school. So favortism seems to be shown to what he says. So I need a legal way to get the emotionally disturbed off the board, and say that this whole time, it’s been the PPD. How do I do that and get the IEP to listen to me? Thank you for reading this.
Chrstina, please search IEEs and Independent Educational Evaluations on my site for more information. Good luck and thanks for reading!
I love this post! As a former CAGS level school psychologist turned law student (2L at Vermont Law), I was cringing and laughing at the same time. It is astonishing how many pseudo psychologists there are. Oftentimes, their only professional qualification is that they may have completed a psycho-pharm. course or some sort of assessment oriented graduate course. Other common traits include having 15+ years in their position at the school along with a decent amount of “political” equity that makes others leery of correcting them. They often tend to put undue emphasis on IQ’s and discrepancy model analyses. Their giveaway tends to be saying things that almost seemed like a diagnosis, followed by a curative recommendation. And yes, these also tend to be the first people to second guess medical opinions and feel comfortable talking about medications, side effects, and treatment options. They also would have you believe they have the DSM-IV memorized. When I knew I was going to be working closely with one of these “pseudo” peers, there tended to be a fine balance in deciding when/how to add-on/correct these individual versus just giving them the opportunity to say their piece and then moving on. For me this divining rod rested in the degree that their pseudo psychological input distracted from the overall intent/purpose of the school-parent communication.
The only thing that is quite laughable is Mr. Tyler’s post. Apparently dropping out of a program can render someone expert in a profession. Mr. Tyler suggests that school psychologist’s use the discrepancy model. Most first year school psyc’s students can tell you the data no longer supports this model. After following this blog for a little while, I find it somewhat confusing. It seems to me that a given profession should police itself, rather than other professions (i.e. law) trying to render opinions about credentials, training, etc, that they have limited understanding of. For example, saying that a school psychologist is not qualified to render a diagnosis is absurd. They specialize in identifying learning disabilities. This is what the profession is founded on. Granted, they do not typically make DSM diagnosis, but they do not have to in the school setting. This is like myself saying A Juris Doctorate only requires 3 years and no dissertation so that to be a “real lawyer” you should complete 5 years, plus 2000 hours of experience and a dissertation to complete the JD and if you do not you are a “pseudo lawyer.” This would be more in accord with other doctorates on other professions. Just a little reminder the JD requires 3 years of study, so does the master’s specialist in school psychology.
It seems the distinction of who is “real” and who is not comes down to a disagreement. If a given school has a psychologist who holds dual doctorate’s in clinical and school psychology who is licensed as a psychologist and a certified school psychologist, and has many publications under his/her belt renders a decision that is disputed by a parent, and that parent seeks legal counsel the lawyer will then begin disputing (or find a hired psychologist) to refute the other psychologists credentials, no matter how well credentialed or respected they are in their field.
Once again Dr. S. you are missing the point. I do not believe and I did not say that there are no school psychologists whose recommendations I agree with, or whose conclusions my clients accept. I usually agree with school psychologist’s conclusions more than I disagree with them. My point in the original piece, and now, is that when a parent brings in an evaluation from a clinical psychologist who IS able to issue a DSM diagnosis and that conclusion is challenged by a school psychologist who is not able to issue the same diagnosis, most parents have no idea that the school pscyhologist is not the same type of professional, they think they are comparing apples to apples when they are comparing apples to oranges. As to professions self-regulating, most do, including the practice of law, but we are also as lawyers required not just to complete a JD from an ABA accredited law school (which is a doctorate, and therefore a terminal degree, unlike a master’s), but we must pass a grueling bar exam that includes multi-state and state-specific criteria, and even then passing a bar does not automatically allow you to practice. Your individual state has criteria for fitness and character which an attorney must also be deemed to have met. But self-regulation doesn’t mean the rest of society gets to have no input into whether a particular profession should be performing certain tasks. Just because I have a juris doctorate doesn’t mean that if I and a whole slew of my lawyer colleagues decided to go out and call ourselves “dr” and perform surgery, that you wouldn’t have something to say about that! You would and you should. My whole point is making sure that parents of children with special needs are educated and empowered as to their rights. If understanding the difference between the training, credentials, roles, and backgrounds of the school psychologist versus the clinical psychologist helps some parents do that, then I am happy.
Wow! This is the most un-informed post I have ever read. There is NO state that allows for the licensing of Bachelor level. The post by “School psych” I feel is very accurate, many times clinical psychologists are being paid to develop a diagnosis for parents. School Psychologist are VERY well trained in both areas of psychology and education. You seem to be looking for a reason why School Psychologists do not provide DSM diagnosis, there is a very good reason for that, and that is because federal and state laws do not require a DSM diagnosis. Yes, many DSM diagnosis can impact education, and many times they do not. This is why IDEA and states have their own guidelines and categories such as Emotional Disturbance. This is why it is fundamental to have training education which many clinical practitioners do not. As for the APA licensure act, I hope you know this did not pass and for good reason, it was probably only drummed up by professionals like you who spew out inaccurate information. I love the point Dr. S makes about the credentialing lawyers alike and your rebuttal does nothing but further prove Dr.S’s point. When you say
“self-regulation doesn’t mean the rest of society gets to have no input into whether a particular profession should be performing certain tasks. Just because I have a juris doctorate doesn’t mean that if I and a whole slew of my lawyer colleagues decided to go out and call ourselves “dr” and perform surgery, that you wouldn’t have something to say about that! You would and you should.”
This wouldn’t happen because you wouldn’t be trained or licensed by ANY medical profession, this is why professionals who practice in schools are under the department of education and those who practice outside are not.
I hardly ever comment on blogs, but this post was just astoundingly inaccurate, and to be produced by a professional is mind blowing.
Again, I welcome even negative comments on the blog, but honestly, why is it so difficult to get anybody who disagrees with this post to provide me with a single, reliable source that no state allows bachelor’s level individuals to be school psychologists? I have even given states where it appears that one could be a school psychologist without an advanced degree, and there is no response to that.
NCSP, I don’t know if you speak for the NASP but according to their website: “There are a few states that continue to certify school psychologists that graduate from programs of less than 60 graduate semester credits; however, NASP maintains that the minimum acceptable education in school psychology is specialist-level training.” Interestingly also that website talks about making sure that kids in public schools “achieve their best”…something that under IDEA kids with disabilities are not presently entitled to, a point which I have heard many, many school psychologists state in IEP meetings and in testimony in Due Process Hearings despite the representation on the website.
My whole point has been to make sure that parents UNDERSTAND what the differences are. Instead of comments that suggest a genuine interest in making sure that parents understand that there are differences, INCLUDING pros and cons to school psychologists versus psychologists otherwise licensed, there seems to be a continued interest in keeping parents in the dark, and instead attacking me for pointing it out.
If either NCSP or Dr S can point me to a legitimate source which states, unequivocally, that a person can’t be a school psychologist in any state without a Master’s or Doctorate, I will be happy to review it and, if necessary, apologize. But so far, I have yet to see it.
As Dr. S pointed out, you need to go to each states website for the information, this can be done from the NASP website that has a link for every state. I am from and currently in Texas, a state where the license falls under the Board of Psychological Examiners, not the State Education, and I like Dr. S promise you, there is NO state that licenses at the Bachelor level. This is for
PA – A school psychologist training program within Pennsylvania includes a master’s degree, an additional thirty credit School Psychology program leading to certification, a Praxis (0401) score of 150, and a one year internship.
NA – Requires at least 60 graduate semester hours beyond the baccalaureate degree (at least 54 of which are exclusive of credit for the supervised internship); a 1200-hour internship
TX – applicants must have completed a graduate degree in psychology from a regionally accredited academic institution, and have completed at least 60 graduate level semester credit hours, no more than 12 of which may be internship hours. Applicants must have completed internship with a minimum of 1200 hours.
I don’t understand how you confused ANY of these to mean bachelor level.
I am going back through the NASP website (which has been updated and is much more user friendly than when I originally posted this article two years ago), but just a few things to note.
According to the site, and I am quoting, but the bolded sections are my emphasis of the quoted language, the following states permit the following circumstances under the links to state certification for school psychology on the NASP website:
“KENTUCKY: Accepts NCSP as a route to school based credential. SEA Credential: School Psychologist: Requires a masters or specialist degree and a minimum of 60 graduate semester hours. The NCSP also is accepted as a route to obtaining a school psychologist credential. A Provisional Credential does not require a graduate degree but requires coursework to be completed and a university recommendation. It is 1 year for full-time internship, 2 years for a half-time internship, and it is nonrenewable for completion of internship year. If the internship is not completed in 1 year, the student must petition the Education Professional Standards Board for an extension.”
” NEVADA: Accepts NCSP as a route to school based credential and satisfies renewal requirements. SEA Credential: Endorsement as a School Psychologist: Must have: 1.Completed a program approved by the Board which prepares a person to be a school psychologist, or 2.Hold the NCSP, or 3.Hold a graduate degree with preparation in school psychology and have earned 60 semester graduate credits from the required areas and have completed practicum and a minimum of 1000 hour internship in school psychology (refer to NAC 391.318 and NAC 391.319 for specific guidelines on required areas). The internship period must consist of two full-time regular consecutive semesters or 1,000 hours of supervised and practical experience. The period must be completed within 3 years after it is started. At least half of the period of internship must be served in an accredited school system or a school system which is approved by the Superintendent of Public Instruction. The remaining part may be served in some other public agency which is approved by the Superintendent.
Provisional Endorsement as a School Psychologist: The Department will issue a provisional endorsement to serve as a school psychologist to an intern who has completed one full-time regular semester or 500 hours of supervised, practical experience in an accredited school system or an approved public agency if at least half the experience has been in the school system and the intern has fulfilled all the other requirements for a regular endorsement. A provisional endorsement to serve as a school psychologist is effective for 2 years but may not be renewed.”
New Mexico’s states that a “provisional license is available for interns completing their graduate program internship in a NM public school.”
“OKLAHOMA: Accepts NCSP as a route to school based credential. Graduation from a NASP approved program meets training standards and is required for out of state applicants. SEA Credential: School Psychologist (Standard Certificate): Requires either completion of a regionally accredited school psychology program in Oklahoma or a graduate program meeting NASP standards. The NCSP credential fulfills the testing and program requirements for school psychologist certification. Â Out of state applicants must pass Praxis of 165 and attend a NASP approved program.
School Psychometrists tend to offer psycho-education assessment services only. Earning this credential requires a degree in school psychometry from a regionally accredited program.”
In Oregon, the following note is listed after a description of school psychologist licensing: “School districts can award various job titles to employees who do not necessarily have school psychologist training but tend to do school psychologist-type work, such as ‘Child Development Specialist’ or ‘Evaluations Specialist’. Occasionally, administrators may hire individuals without a full school psychologist’s credential or license to fill the role of school psychologist; the state gives district administration broad powers to ‘misassign’ (work outside of your area of licensure) up to 25% of a school’s licensed staff before a school is deemed ‘below standards.’”
In West Virginia, a “Temporary Professional Student Support Certificate: Issued to applicants who have completed a school psychologist program from a regionally accredited college or university outside of West Virginia with a minimum GPA of 3.0 and are eligible to be recommended by the college or university but have not met the testing requirements established by the West Virginia Board of Education. [148 on Praxis II]”
In Wisconsin: An “emergency license” may be issued by the Department of Public Instruction under very specific circumstances. In such a case, the hiring district administrator or designee requests an emergency license be issued, indicating that a search was conducted for a fully licensed school psychologist and that no fully licensed school psychologist was acceptable for the assignment.”
I realize that several (though not all) of these are examples of emergency or provisional licensing, but I tend to doubt that the parents in these public schools whose children are being evaluated by or whose IEP teams include such individuals have been so informed. While I had no involvement in the 2009 movement within the APA (see NASP’s opposition to it here: http://www.nasponline.org/standards/apamla.aspx) and only learned of it via a comment on this blog, it would seem to me that the doctoral level school psychologists would serve their own profession well by making sure that public is clear about the differences. Given all of the different working “titles” and levels and opportunities for individuals to “play the role of” a psychologist within our public schools, as per the descriptions above, I hardly think the average parent would know where to begin to question their credentials.
I’m interested in getting some feedback on a school psychologist v clinical psychologist situation.
Recently we had an IEP meeting for my daughter who is a fifth year SPED student with ADD/ADHD and Dyslexia , Auditory and Speech. After years of dealing with evaluations from the school psychologist we pulled the trigger on an independent pediatric neuro psychologist. The findings were chasmic. When we had the IEP and I we asked the school psychologist her opinion we found she knew very little about the brain science aspect of the diagnosis. In fact beyond the surface level information that most of us knew she had nothing new to share. However since we needed this opinion at the IEP meeting I asked for a brain science specialist to be provided by the district who was informed on specific pediatric brain science. The district responded The specific school psychologist who will attend is a a Nationally Certified School Psychologist and the school psychologists have the appropriate licensures and certifications as required per the state of FL Department of Education to evaluate students. They are well qualified to provide professional recommendations as members of the IEP Team regarding the student’s needs relevant to the educational learning environment. We do not feel that we are refusing your request, therefore a Notice of Refusal will not be issued. We have offered to provide the appropriate , qualified, and experienced professionals to attend the meeting that can provide the information relevant to the IEP Team. You are welcome to bring anyone, including a Certified Pediatric Neuropsychologist, with you to the meeting.
My question is if the school psychologist couldn’t answer the questions the first time out do I have aright to request for someone who can and ask that they have this level of training? I think this is at the heart of the prior conversation and to Jennifer’s point. And understanding Dr. S points but even with a master’s level education it’s completely not enough and inappropriate for a school psychologist to hold themselves out or give the impression to parents that they can articulate and recommend complex points in the cognitive arena when really many of them clearly DO NOT have this level of experience. The term psychologist (whether it be school or elsewhere) in this instance (and in many others I’m aware of) carry a tacit idea of being an expert in all areas of psychology relating to a child’s education , when in actuality they can potentially inflect more harm than good as in this case this professional was clearly unqualified to speak to her issues, but yet had been for the past 3 years! I’m quite pissed about that to be truthful. So I get the point.
Father Advocate…it would seem to me that you are asking two different questions. First is whether your school district properly evaluated your child. That is a complex questions that will be based on numerous factors, including whether the IEE revealed new information that your IEP team should have evaluated or identified. Second is whether you are entitled to insist on having the independent neuropsychologist, or someone of that level of training, as a member of the IEP Team. Please read this post on what a duly constituted IEP Team requires: http://www.connecticutspecialeducationlawyer.com/tips-for-parents/decisions-decisionsand-why-an-iep-team-must-be-able-to-make-them/.
Your district is correct in informing you that you are entitled to invite whomever you want to the IEP meeting, but of course that would be at your expense. And I really despise any situation where a parent is refused a request but is told that they aren’t “really” refusing that require “officially.” That raises a red flag for me; and I am not familiar with your states “Notice of Refusal,” so I would check with local counsel to find out if this is in violation of any states laws in Florida. Ultimately, if a district convenes an IEP meeting with the officially required players, they are probably in compliance…but that does not mean that the IEP team’s decisions, absent the involvement of somebody who really understands your child’s disabilities, is in a position to develop an appropriate IEP. That would be the argument I would make, more so than that the IEP team did not have the required members.
I would invite either the school psychologists or others following this chain to reply.
The Father Advocate question is very tricky. While I do feel that school psyc’s should have a working knowledge of neuro psychology, it is important to note that clinical psychologists nor school psychologists are “neuro-psychologists.” However, one must understand that this is a very, very specialized area. While neuropsychology is instrumental in understanding the behavior and underlying neurological basis of a particular problem, I still maintain a well trained school psychologist is the best person to ascertain the educational impact and how to help that student academically.
Getting back to the question, the school is to provide an “appropriate” education and assessment, not necessarily the “best” evaluator or assessment. With this said, I think the real question is despite the neuropsychological terms and diagnoses included in your neuro report, can the district provide appropriate modifications for your student to be successful in the classroom? So, though an average school psychologist may or may not understand the intricacies of the role or executive function and ADHD and the role of the temporal lobe in language skills, the real question becomes what is the child’s need and can they make appropriate accommodations to help your student be successful in the classroom setting? For example, an individual does not necessarily have to know the role of working memory in dyslexia, but that a program emphasizing phonics and fluency development will help the student make gains.
What I would respectfully suggest is to bring your outside report along with the neuro-psychologists recommendations and ask the school if they could utilize those recommendations included in the report or at least approximations of them because they can help the student improve their skills and feel more confident, etc. I feel this would be the most productive path to take with the school and a good first step.
Just want to clarify that the “appropriateness” standard (versus “best”) in the IDEA applies to special education programs (parents are entitled under IDEA to a Free and “Appropriate” Public Education, or “FAPE”), not necessarily to evaluations or assessments. I’m not suggesting that parents are necessarily entitled to the best assessments under the sun, only that neither the statutory nor regulatory framework of the IDEA defines an “appropriate” standard for evaluation.
Going back to the education issue, not only do no states offer school psychology degrees at the Bachelor’s level, the Master’s as a terminal degree seems to be growing obsolete; the Specialist’s degree is the norm for minimal degree required.
Based on the individual state requirements as posted by Jennifer, one cannot necessarily assume a Bachelor’s is sufficient for school psych practice. There are too many “gaps” in Jennifer’s argument on this particular point.
KY: Jennifer’s bolded point likely refers to the credential required to be an Intern en route to the Specialist’s degree. I had a similar type of credential as an intern in Illinois. This was because I did not yet complete all requirements for full Type 73 certification (obviously, since I was an intern and was working on that requirement).
NV: Jennifer’s bolded point doesn’t say anything about bachelor’s. Given point #3 later in this paragraph one can conclude that a master’s is the minimum education required.
NM: Same thoughts as KY.
OK: Similar argument as with NV. To quote Jennifer’s post, “Requires either completion of a regionally accredited school psychology program in Oklahoma or a graduate program meeting NASP standards.” Just because the former part of this sentence does not list “master’s” does not imply that it is a “bachelor’s”. Rather, the sentence is intended to distinguish between OK and other states.
WV: Similar argument as OK.
In conclusion, unless it states Bachelor’s, do not assume Bachelor’s if it does not state Master’s specifically as well.
Correction to my NV point; I meant that a graduate degree was required (I originally stated Master’s, which is not explicitly stated in point #3.)
Michelle, thanks for commenting again, and for your points. I continue to question whether there are some states that permit this, but see where you are coming from. Sadly, my experience has not been that we can assume that the interpretation of statutory language will cut in favor of more protections, rather, the opposite is usually true, and many administrators at the state and local levels will try to get by with as little cost as possible, which usually translates into lesser credentials. Again, my overall point remains that I don’t think parents really understand at all the differences, and when they hear “psychologist,” they think “doctor.” Speaking of which, you refer to the Master’s as a “terminal degree”…my understanding of that term has usually been that one achieves the highest possible degree in their field, aren’t there any doctoral programs in school psychology? I thought there were, but perhaps I was mistaken.
Ms. Laviano,
There are indeed many doctoral programs in school psychology and also combined school and child-clinical psychology. Some as I did go the clinical route and obtain the doctorate and then re-specialize in school psych via certification from the state board of ed. As always, I am a big advocate of parents being well informed and encourage them to ask questions. I am always more than happy to discuss my background and training with parents. I fully appreciate that we are making very important decisions about their children.
However, perhaps because one does not need the doctorate to practice the master’s specialist seems to be more popular. I might also add that school districts often offer little more in the way of compensation for those with a doctorate versus a specialist. Many with Doctorates stay in academia where the doctorate mandatory.
From a special education teacher’s perspective, and currently working on Educational Diagnostician certification and Master’s degree, I must share. I have experienced the gamut of personalities on all sides. Please keep in mind that we are not an enemy. I become very attached to my students, but I try not to allow emotions to interfere with important decisions regarding their education. I have held IEP meetings with volunteer advocates in attendance who often were other parents playing the “pseudo-psychologist.” The IEP child’s parent feels they have a voice through this person, but this person may not be the best to represent their child’s needs. Regarding diagnosis, there are instances in which the parent brings in a diagnosis that was conducted by a nurse practitioner, not psychologist, psychiatrist, or physician. Our district follows the criteria implemented at state level. These are very strict guidelines. Educational diagnosticians and school psychologists must follow the guidelines. If these are not followed, the school district can be subject to law suits filed by the child’s family.
Reading parent comments on various sites helps me to keep a healthy and fair perspective.
Unfortunately, it seems that the direction of Special Education is moving away from individual needs. Due to NCLB, my students are required to perform on grade level and are subject to standardized tests for promotion. I am required to teach grade level curriculum, which can make it difficult to help students work toward their IEP goals. Yes, we implement accommodations and modifications, but only within the curriculum framework. This is a frustrating time for both parents and teachers. I just wanted to present another perspective, food for thought.
Would like to clarify: Parents are not entitled to FAPE, children are.
Specialists generally have received an additional certificate, not another degree. A Master’s may be prerequisite to the certification. That is,my Master’s will be in Special Education. I currently hold certification in Mild/Moderate 1-12, and will also have a certification for Educational Diagnostician. After one additional class, I will also have a certificate for Reading Specialist. These are all state issued and may not be recognized by other states.
There are bachelor degrees in psychology, but school districts do not generally hire at that level. Similarly, speech pathologists with bachelor’s degree are limited and must work under direct supervision of a pathologist with master’s or higher.
Obviously, some states have higher standards than others. This may be due to the pool of professionals they have to pull from.
At first, I wasn’t going to add anything to this thread but upon noticing the recent additions I feel compelled. I am the parent of a child with ADHD, Asperger’s Syndrome, dyspraxia, asthma, anaphylaxis and a processing disorder. I am one of those uninformed parents who was bullied by a “school psychologist” who told the IEP team that my professional evaluation and diagnosis was irrelevant and that she did not see ANY evidence of anything listed other than ADHD and that due to my decision NOT to medicate my child there was really nothing the school would need to do to address his needs. At due process and under oath, she admitted that she was not qualified OR licensed by the State of Florida to render a diagnosis of any kind. This is the point that Jennifer has been trying to make. There are good school psychologists and bad just as there are good clinical psychologists and bad. You and your credentials and the licensing requirement standards for the whole country was not the point of this thread. The point was that no matter how qualified or trained or good you may be does not mean that everyone running around calling themselves a school psychologist has the proper training, credentialing or licensing to be pandering diagnoses for children. Personally, I am more concerned with the message Jennifer is providing – that it is important to ask for the credentials of any “expert” before assuming them to be what they are not – is much more important than defining for the whole country what is or is not in every possible hypothetical situation. As a parent of a special needs child who has had to fight for every ounce of services because of school “experts” who have no licensing in this state are contradicting the evaluations of licensed professionals. I would be more than happy to compare the evaluations of my independent licensed clinical child psychologist who has specialized in children’s educational needs for 20 years that the school “psychologist” who is not a licensed clinical psychologist and is not nor has ever been qualified to apply for and obtain such a license. She is not authorized by any law in the State of Florida to diagnose a child. That is the bottom line of this thread. People like that misleading parents AND IEP teams that they are qualified to contradict a properly obtained evaluation of a licensed practitioner. They even like to contradict the evaluations of medical doctors for which they have received NO training whatsoever above a basic first aid and CPR course.
I think my request for a 504 Plan was just derailed by one of these Pseudo-Psychologists. It was painful and wrong, and my child deserves better.
In Beaumont Unified School District in California, we forced the CV of the school psychologist out of the district and found that she had a BA in psychology with an MA educational administration. So even if they have a Masters, what’s it in.?
On the 504 plan, it’s imjnportant to remember that a 504 plan is not reaqlly parallel to an IEP, because 504 is a civil rights statute, not a funding and affirmative action statute like IDEA. In some ways, as Reed Martin used to point out, it offers a lot more.
In the first place, without an IEP, which determines the services required, the school owes nothing under IDEA except some procedural safeguards. But plan or no, the district owes everything under 504 that the statute and regulations, including a level of FAPE much more robust than the crappy Rowley standard (34 CFR 104.34). You bother asking them for a 504 plan. You require of them what Section 504 requires. Google 34 CFR 104 and ponder the regulations there. It’s very good stuff. If you get them by the regulations, their 504 plan or even an IEP will follow. And when we have an IEP, we need to always keep in the forefront of our minds what we’re entitled to under 504. Many times they have a strong position under IDEA, but no case under 504, so that you can overcome them that way. In particular, they have no ground not to qualify you if there’s a problem – check out the definition of “handicapped person” at 34 104.3(j).
First, I have to admit that I did not read many of the above comments as I’m chompin at the bit to write a response. I am in total agreement that there are many school psychologists who present like pseudo-psychologists, practicing beyond their level of training, saying and doing stupid things. There are just as many, if not more, who are adequately trained and quite competent. But, it cannot be assumed that someone working as a school psychologist is not also a fully licensed clinical psychologist who has the training to make a clinical diagnosis. Also, it cannot be assumed that a psychologist or other mental health professional who works outside of the schools or in private practice knows more than a school psychologist with regards to what placement or services a child needs in the school setting without ever having observed the child at school or ever having seen the kinds of services available in the child’s school district. I’ve seen my share of “doctor’s orders” written on a prescription pad calling for a specific special education placement.
Of course there are many times where an independent opinion is required and parents can avail themselves of this option at public expense. But it is critical that the independent or private clinician have direct knowledge of how the child presents in the school setting for their opinion to have maximum value. Otherwise, their opinion will be “considered” and then summarily dismissed.
By the way, I started my career in Connecticut (at CES) back in the olden days when PL94-142 was relatively new. If anyone reading this remembers me, hi.
What an important topic! I just read this whole thread of information and feel as both a parent and professional that it is absolutely critical that parents are made aware of people’s credentials and their training.
I am a Speech Language Pathologist in a school and in our state, an SLP in a school does not necessarily have the training. Here and many other states, an individual that is applying to graduate programs in speech language pathology can be granted licenses where they can act as the SLP, sometimes never even getting accepted into a graduate program. Also in my state and others, these individuals may legally carry the title “Speech Language Pathologist” without having the minimum Master’s degree….just on the hope they are working towards getting a Master’s degree. And no one from the issuing agency is even checking back on these individual’s progress towards getting that degree. This carries with it, of course, that they can complete testing, diagnose children etc. Very inappropriate practice that unbelievably is legal for now. I talked to someone at our state speech hearing association who said several states are working towards changing this practice but that school administrators and even some SLPs are supportive of it. Administration, I understand because I think they mostly think about the bottom dollar but SLPs, I don’t understand as this is not a good representation of our profession. And it’s certainly not best practice for the children which is what the bottom line SHOULD be here.
Another practice here and other states is that people without any training at all in speech language pathology can be issued a short term emergency license, usually 1 year. They provide “speech therapy” to children without any training at all! So the folks in this category don’t even have bachelor’s level coursework in speech language pathology. Some districts abuse this license option by hiring these types of individuals year after year. That is not an “emergency” but a practice.
What I have learned from all of this is to make no assumptions about anyone’s credentials or competency. I ask any professionals that we work with about their training.
To the dear school psychologists on here who got ruffled. I understand. What you do is important and I don’t think anyone is questioning that. The way I read it is knowing the differences in credentials is important information for parents. I was personally floored when I learned that people who had no training at all were acting as SLPs in schools around our state….legally. So it wouldn’t surprise me one bit if a state out there has figured out how to wiggle out of the highest standards and issue licenses to less than qualified people as School Psychologists, maybe on an emergency basis, like they do here for SLPs.
And unlike someone wrote above, the individuals in my state who are licensed on an emergency basis or on the hoping-to-get-into-a-graduate-program are NOT supervised by an SLP necessarily. In our state, the requirements for these individuals are much, much less than for a person still in training where the amount and type of supervision is spelled out clearly. With these individuals there is no supervision requirements at all in our state. It’s funny to me that a person with an associate’s degree to be an aide to an SLP has very strict guidelines about supervision and what they can and can not do but people with no training – there is no guidelines at all. They can just act as an SLP. Very upside down type of system in my opinion that does not best serve the children.
Assume nothing is my new mantra with professionals I deal with.
Important topic. Thanks to everyone for contributing.
Joel – I am very often on IEP teams and I too have gotten a few “prescriptions” from well-meaning doctors to “provide speech therapy”.
I take it the way it’s meant – a doctor in the medical field who is trying to refer a child for articulation testing. Sometimes I laugh and wish for the ability to fill a pill bottle that said “speech therapy” and pass it out to the kids. 
If only it were that simple I would be out of a job.
Anyway. I think it probably depends on the IEP team as to whether something is just barely considered then dismissed. I think how a child is functioning at home or in a clinical psychologist’s office as opposed to the school environment is very important information and I would probably be so bold to ask that question at an IEP meeting. People, including children, don’t have a condition in one setting and not another. There are reasons for differences and they should be discussed and if possible addressed at the meeting….in my opinion of course. It could be a child is more comfortable without the peer pressure or the sensory stimulation at school is overwhelming them or they have difficulty listening, attending and understanding in a busy classroom and perform better with just one person and less distractions or, or, or….lots of possible reasons that could be brought up. An outside report, in my opinion, is always an opportunity to understand the child in more depth.
I welcome reports that parents have gotten from private speech language pathologists. If a child misarticulates a sound he will do it everywhere. I am sort of assuming here but seems to me the same would true for other disorders – that a child will have adhd or autism or emotional disturbance everywhere. Although, I do know in our state, while a child may meet criteria for autism under dsm 4 criteria, they may not meet criteria for educational eligibility. Always seems very strange but I have seen it happen a few times now. Who is right probably depends on all the players and their expertise in their various fields.
The school psychologist has filled this role in our experience. She decided that my son was psychotic based on little to no evidence. He repeated something he said and she decided that this was echolalia. In fact, he said that he did not want to speak to the school psychologist and repeated it. Then the school psychologist wrote this all over every page of the proposed IEP (the one I did NOT sign). I got other evaluations for his difficult and strange behavior from a clinical psychologist and a psychiatrist and these did not agree with what the school psychologist was saying. The school did not want to consider these. I got all this thrown out by refusing to sign the IEP. I wrote them diplomatic but firm letters stating why, even though I got shouted at and pressured. The school psychologist really ranted at the IEP meeting about how my son was psychotic. I was preparing to call the NY state department of education and complain.
I got him treated based on the recommendations of the clinical psychologist and the psychiatrist and he did not have any more behavior problems in school. He has never been psychotic. I refused their self-contained class placement and he has done well in school for the past two years.
But I cringe every time I hear a parent say, “You can’t disagree with the school psychogist.”
By the way, Dr. S, the IEP team includes the parent. You seem to miss that point. So saying that the IEP team has the power to accept or reject outside evaluations (presumably obtained by the parent) is problematic right there.
Further, IEPs must be done according to the IDEA federal legislation (and a good thing, too!) School personnel on the IEP team cannot just do as they choose..
Elizabeth,
I agree wholeheartedly that the parent is an essential piece of the IEP team, in my opinion as much of a piece as anyone at the table! While my comment may be problematic and even frustrating to you, in the state where I practice it is indeed the case that the IEP team should (not required to) consider the outside evaluation. Not wanting to repeat myself, I will say that I have come across far too many outside evaluations from the “ADHD” guy (i.e. that outside provider psychiatrist or outside clinical psychologist who always finds everyone ADHD) that are often inaccurate, misleading, and often written in a manner that is completely useless to the school setting. Let me invite you to consider that it is sometimes even in the child’s best interest to not consider some recommendations or findings in a report, depending on what it is.
In reading your comments I am greatly disappointed at how your situation was managed. A diagnosis of psychosis should always be done collaboratively and usually with outside providers because the diagnosis is so rare in youngsters. My feedback to parents is to be aware of the different specialties and level of credentials of the people working with your students. Ask questions. I am always very open and happy to go over my education, background, and credentials with a parent.
I also have to caution someone who may have had a negative experience with one school psychologist and over generalize this to: I have had a negative experience with one, therefore all school psychologists are pseudo psychologists and not as good as clinical psychologists. I think we have all had one bad experience with a physician, accountant, lawyer, teacher, etc… The solution is to educate yourself.
Dr. S., by federal law, which trumps any state law, IEP teams MUST CONSIDER any outside evaluation. That doesn’t mean they have to follow it, but they must consider it.